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Papa Lazarou View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Papa Lazarou Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2015 at 8:16pm
I don't remember any romantic angle in the Matt Smith era outside of River Song who was worthy of his affections. In fact, the only time a companion showed an interest at him was Amy, which had a good story reason as was very firmly turned down with the Doctor going out of his way to fix her relationship.

The Doctor's daliances were even more him being the victim of undesired attention rather than the kissy-kissy romance aspetect of 10, where he had to snog everyone.

As far as Missy, they're very much Bugs Bunny and Elmer Fudd. any sort of flirtation is to unnerve and unease, not romantic. Missy even said it in the latest episode "Oh try, nano-brain, to rise above your breeding frenzy and contemplate friendship. A friendship older than your civilization and infinitely more complex."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jimmy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2015 at 8:48pm
Originally posted by Papa Lazarou Papa Lazarou wrote:

I don't remember any romantic angle in the Matt Smith era outside of River Song who was worthy of his affections. In fact, the only time a companion showed an interest at him was Amy, which had a good story reason as was very firmly turned down with the Doctor going out of his way to fix her relationship.

The Doctor's daliances were even more him being the victim of undesired attention rather than the kissy-kissy romance aspetect of 10, where he had to snog everyone.

As far as Missy, they're very much Bugs Bunny and Elmer Fudd. any sort of flirtation is to unnerve and unease, not romantic. Missy even said it in the latest episode "Oh try, nano-brain, to rise above your breeding frenzy and contemplate friendship. A friendship older than your civilization and infinitely more complex."
l

I stand corrected concerning the romantic angle during the Matt Smith era. I think I was still thinking about the annoying romantic angles from the Tennant years. Tennant was a very good Doctor, but the writers became obsessed with the whole love interest angle.
You're also right about Missy, but I just cannot stand her character when she says that she's former "friend" of the Doctor. The Master was an acquaintance of the time lord, but was never a friend.....at least it was never shown in the past episodes from the "vintage" episodes. The Master is evil, and so is Missy. End of story. I see her about as loveable as Davros, so it makes me wretch when I see her dance around, as she was doing when Capaldi was playing his guitar.

Isn't it great to have the show back again?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Papa Lazarou Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2015 at 9:55pm
Actually, it was, if you don't mind me showing my geek to you.

There's quite a few instances where we see the Doctor and Master expressing mutual respect for each other. The doctor has the Master imprisoned rather that killed, and even visits and chats with him. There's references to their times on Gallifrey together. In one of the last Delgado stories there was even the intention of revealing the Master to be the Doctor's brother, but the one bit of dialogue that did this was cut.

They speak of their times at school together (In a friendshippy way, not just acquaitancy) several times in the 3rd Doctor's era, and even team up with each other a few times (when it suits the Master) Logopolis was a good example of the Doctor and Master showing their respect for each other.

though, this stuff was more vague and kept in its place. It's the RTD era that really pushed it heavily into the modern mindset with them talking about their childhood together and the disgustingly saccharine dialogue Tennant was stuck with "You could be so beautiful".

So, I think Moffat pretty much had his hands tied and has made the best of a bad situation. He'd get the whinier fans on his ass for daring to ignore the plotline RTD had followed with the Doctor/Master relationship, but he didn't want it to be as blatantly slashy and homoerotic as RTD had made the Tennant/Simms relationship.

So we get Missy. A psychotic misogynistic woman who knows how to use her moneymakers to play her victims and who is someone with good traits (as all the Masters have had, when you actually examine their motives) but hates to admit it and acts out when they're mentined.

Ultimately, the Doctor and Master are the same person. The Doctor wants to make the universe a better place by helping out where he can and hoping the people he helps make the right choices. The Master wants to make the universe a better place by controlling it and everyone in it and destroying all opposition. For one, the end justifies the means, and for the other the means justify the end. :P
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Papa Lazarou Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2015 at 9:59pm
For what it's worth, I adore Davros and want to be him when I grow up. :P

As for The Master and Missy, well...megalomania has always been oddly attractive to me. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jimmy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Sep 2015 at 1:19pm
Originally posted by Papa Lazarou Papa Lazarou wrote:

For what it's worth, I adore Davros and want to be him when I grow up. :P

As for The Master and Missy, well...megalomania has always been oddly attractive to me. 


True points, and very well taken. It's awesome to meet a Yank who is such a Doctor Who fan.
The trouble I have with almost constant insurgence of the Missy character in each episode today is simple. The Master used to make an appearance on occasion in the vintage days, not the constant "side-story" of what he's planning, like they seem to be doing with this Missy rendition. Like when she sits in her garden at the close of the episode, welcoming characters who've been eliminated. If the writers are going to have a show down with her, just f**king do it, then close out her character until she regenerates.
Bloody hell, her character reminds me of Moriarty on Sherlock. The Master used to be an occasisional annoyance, not a constant threat, hanging over the Doctor like the sword of Damocles!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Papa Lazarou Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Sep 2015 at 4:04pm
True, but again, I think it's just a bit of left-over from RTD's era. He was very big on that "Have a little word, phrase, or character (Rose in series 4) pop up now and again to set up the big finale.

I can forgive Missy's mysterious appearances in Series 8 because the reveal still managed to be a pretty big "OH MY GOD, WHAT?" And it did a good job of making you think more about what was happening to these people rather than who Missy was. As prominent as she was she managed to keep herself out of the limelight until it got closer to the finale.

As for Series 9, it seems she's going to be in this story, and maybe show up a few more times, but not be constant.

And just to play devil's advocate again, the Master appeared in all five stories from the series where he was introduced as a character His appearances do decrease, yes, but there is a precedent for a very constant appearance by the Master.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jimmy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 2015 at 8:24pm
Bloody hell! Okay, I'm converted ! Michelle Gomez, the lady portraying Missy, is a bloody great bad guy, or should I say gal. This latest show was absolutely BRILLIANT!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Papa Lazarou Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2015 at 1:17am
Yep!

Some people on another board I go to complain about her being too silly and over-the-top, but to me that just makes the portrayal even more chilling. Yes, she's being silly ranting in an American Accent, but the actually idea of what she's doing - mercilessly laughing and making fun of a dalek being savagely killed by its own kind - is chilling. The jokey-bit where she shows Clara the "censoring" of the Daleks is horrifying, because she's reveling in Clara being stripped of her identity and emotions.

And of course that bit at the end when she -spoilers- and the Doctor is literally ready to kill her on sight. It's such a great performance. Considering this is a family/children's show at heart, I do not think these moments could have worked with a serious, hardened, hardcore approach, it'd just be way too scary and vile for a show whose audience includes under-12s. Missy is a perfect blend of visual hilarity with a slimy layer of evil.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Snesgamer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2015 at 1:21am
This is coming from someone who hates both Missy and Clara individually - they are magic together when they work as a "team". I still want them gone, but that was some entertaining stuff!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Jimmy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2015 at 3:35pm
Originally posted by Snesgamer Snesgamer wrote:

This is coming from someone who hates both Missy and Clara individually - they are magic together when they work as a "team". I still want them gone, but that was some entertaining stuff!



I don't dislike Jenna Coleman's portrayal of Clara, but her role on the show as Peter Capaldi's version of the Doctor is almost pointless. Capaldi doesn't seem to need a companion, yet Clara is a left-over from the Matt Smith era.
I would love to Capaldi going on adventures alone, perhaps being joined after awhile with a companion he can relate to.

Missy could star in a side programme, very much like the whole Torchwood series, but more sinister, in as much as she is the Doctor's nemesis.
I don't dislike as much now. After seeing her latest episode, I actually like her version of the female form of "the Master".
The fact that she's Scottish like Peter Capaldi, adds to the pleasure of their arguments. Lord knows, the bloody Scot's love arguing!
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